Friday, July 30, 2010
Every time I think that pre-Heresy ers Thousand sons list is dead in the water.....
See THIS link.... Ok combine those with THESE and THESE , and you can have a very convincing Warhammer 30k army.....
Saturday, July 24, 2010
Horde O' DOOOOOOOMMMMM guard weak points
Well I posted the strong points and the guts of the list. I went through things for a player to keep track of (like keeping those commissars to the front of the mob) and what kind of support units would really help the mobs. Now I need to talk about what kinds of things could really hurt it.
1. massed templates will ruin this lists day. Another guard army with twin manticores or lots of russes will melt it.
2. anything that can reduce leadership like a psyker battle squad could make it run, as they over-ride the stubborn rules.
3. high initiative hordes like hormagaunts in the tyranid list would eat this alive. they go first all day long, and when coupled with paroxysm will make you hit last and hit on 5s.
These are just a couple of examples, but are enough for me to not try this list, even though I likely could field it now with the models in the box downstairs. How do you counter these big holes? you tell me. If i can find a suitable counter to this stuff I might try to make it work. Besides, once I see the look on my opponents face as 150 guardsmen come running accross the table it might be worth it!
1. massed templates will ruin this lists day. Another guard army with twin manticores or lots of russes will melt it.
2. anything that can reduce leadership like a psyker battle squad could make it run, as they over-ride the stubborn rules.
3. high initiative hordes like hormagaunts in the tyranid list would eat this alive. they go first all day long, and when coupled with paroxysm will make you hit last and hit on 5s.
These are just a couple of examples, but are enough for me to not try this list, even though I likely could field it now with the models in the box downstairs. How do you counter these big holes? you tell me. If i can find a suitable counter to this stuff I might try to make it work. Besides, once I see the look on my opponents face as 150 guardsmen come running accross the table it might be worth it!
Thursday, July 22, 2010
Horde tactics with Imperial Guard
I have been discussing this tactic with a few friends, and I have seen it posted around the net in different forms. Can it be done? CAN you make an effective assault based imperial guard list? I think so, and this is how I might try it. Now, our local games are normally based at 1750 points, so I will stay at that limit for this list.
HQ is easy. I think twin Lord Commissars, each with a powerfist. These will be split one to each mob, which I will get to in a moment. I would also take 4 munitorum priests, each with an eviscerator. Here I split them into pairs, one with each mob, as dicussed below.
For Troops I take 2 identical platoons as mobbed up squads, the "mobs" I was referring to above. Each as follows: Junior officer with power weapon, add a Commissar with a power weapon. Then add 5 infantry squads each sergeant has a power weapon and commissar with power weapon. This totals 64 models each, or 128 between the two mobs. Each platoon deploys to the front of your deployment zone, with as much as they can muster in cover. Then move forward and run screaming at your enemy. These squads will never get all of their attacks at once, but you can move all of those special weapons toward the front lines. Even if just these get into combat it looks like this: 4 s6 powerfist hits, 6 s6 eviscerator hits, 48 s3 power weapon hits....then the regular joes hit.....2 attacks each x50.....well you get the idea. Now there are a few things to remember about alist like this, and it looks scary, but check this out.
-Without exception all of those attacks are made at initiative 3 or less.
-These squads are Leadership 10, with multiple commissars in the units, they are NOT going to break.
-All of these guys are on foot, so you are moving almost 125 models by hand, and deploying 125, and then removing most of them every game.....man my back hurts already!
-On the same note your opponent is already scratching his head wondering if he can kill that many models before they get to him....and I haven't even touched on the support for this list, just the core at less than a thousand points spent!!! Something to be said for intimidation....
So how DO you support this? well, you need a ton of anti tank to crack open tin cans so your mobs can eat the gooey center...it needs to be mobile, and long lived. While there are several ways to do this, I think a squadron or two of lascannon load-out vendettas should do it. I also think a few heavies to support the combat with higher strength are in order. Two chimeras with maxed out ogryn squads should do well in that role. Ok so assume 4 vendettas, and 2 squads of ogryns, and you are looking at north of 150 models without any armour value higher than 12 in truly frightening list.
-Will it crumble quickly? no, but you will be putting models away as fast as you got them out, so get used to that.
-Will it break and run? no never. Those commissars are the last models removed, and until they are dead, the squads go nowhere.
-Can it hold objectives? not well. Really this list needs to be played with a conga-line approach to objectives, or have a veteran squad or two left in the backfield with more heavy weapons.
Thoughts?
HQ is easy. I think twin Lord Commissars, each with a powerfist. These will be split one to each mob, which I will get to in a moment. I would also take 4 munitorum priests, each with an eviscerator. Here I split them into pairs, one with each mob, as dicussed below.
For Troops I take 2 identical platoons as mobbed up squads, the "mobs" I was referring to above. Each as follows: Junior officer with power weapon, add a Commissar with a power weapon. Then add 5 infantry squads each sergeant has a power weapon and commissar with power weapon. This totals 64 models each, or 128 between the two mobs. Each platoon deploys to the front of your deployment zone, with as much as they can muster in cover. Then move forward and run screaming at your enemy. These squads will never get all of their attacks at once, but you can move all of those special weapons toward the front lines. Even if just these get into combat it looks like this: 4 s6 powerfist hits, 6 s6 eviscerator hits, 48 s3 power weapon hits....then the regular joes hit.....2 attacks each x50.....well you get the idea. Now there are a few things to remember about alist like this, and it looks scary, but check this out.
-Without exception all of those attacks are made at initiative 3 or less.
-These squads are Leadership 10, with multiple commissars in the units, they are NOT going to break.
-All of these guys are on foot, so you are moving almost 125 models by hand, and deploying 125, and then removing most of them every game.....man my back hurts already!
-On the same note your opponent is already scratching his head wondering if he can kill that many models before they get to him....and I haven't even touched on the support for this list, just the core at less than a thousand points spent!!! Something to be said for intimidation....
So how DO you support this? well, you need a ton of anti tank to crack open tin cans so your mobs can eat the gooey center...it needs to be mobile, and long lived. While there are several ways to do this, I think a squadron or two of lascannon load-out vendettas should do it. I also think a few heavies to support the combat with higher strength are in order. Two chimeras with maxed out ogryn squads should do well in that role. Ok so assume 4 vendettas, and 2 squads of ogryns, and you are looking at north of 150 models without any armour value higher than 12 in truly frightening list.
-Will it crumble quickly? no, but you will be putting models away as fast as you got them out, so get used to that.
-Will it break and run? no never. Those commissars are the last models removed, and until they are dead, the squads go nowhere.
-Can it hold objectives? not well. Really this list needs to be played with a conga-line approach to objectives, or have a veteran squad or two left in the backfield with more heavy weapons.
Thoughts?
Monday, July 19, 2010
And the wheels they keep on turnin'
Those of you who know me know I am CONSTANTLY thinking of list ideas and bouncing them off my friends. The only downside to this is the size of my wallet. With 8th edition fantasy now available I am thinking about a couple of lists to give me some variety over just my vampires. What do you all think?
List 1: Chaos Mortals Troll Hammer
chaos sorcerer on disc with level 4 upgrade
chaos sorcerer on disc with level 4 upgrade
Troll king Throgg
3x 6 trolls
2x 5 hounds
2x dragon ogre shaggoth with great weapon
List 2: Ogre Kingdoms Oni of DOOOOOOOOMMMMM.....hur, hur, hur......
Tyrant
2x Butchers
2x 6 bulls
6 ironguts
2x 5 lead belchers
2x 20 gnoblar fighters
2x scraplaunchas
Both lists are hammers with serious magical support, if not the same theme. I think the ogres will get a (stolen) Oni theme, various shades of blue skin for all but the butchers (greens) and the leadbelchers (reds). The ogres rely on impact and stomp hits with buffs from the butchers.
The Trolls are a regeneration nightmare. The sorcs can throw spells all day long and the real hammers here are the shaggoths. The lists are both small model counts that rely on the monstrous infantry rules to inflict damage. I have screening units in both to help get them into combat intact and magic to bust a few holes in things as I close in. What do you all think? Which one would do better? They the same? I think ogres have the shooting advantage, where the trolls can regenerate....
List 1: Chaos Mortals Troll Hammer
chaos sorcerer on disc with level 4 upgrade
chaos sorcerer on disc with level 4 upgrade
Troll king Throgg
3x 6 trolls
2x 5 hounds
2x dragon ogre shaggoth with great weapon
List 2: Ogre Kingdoms Oni of DOOOOOOOOMMMMM.....hur, hur, hur......
Tyrant
2x Butchers
2x 6 bulls
6 ironguts
2x 5 lead belchers
2x 20 gnoblar fighters
2x scraplaunchas
Both lists are hammers with serious magical support, if not the same theme. I think the ogres will get a (stolen) Oni theme, various shades of blue skin for all but the butchers (greens) and the leadbelchers (reds). The ogres rely on impact and stomp hits with buffs from the butchers.
The Trolls are a regeneration nightmare. The sorcs can throw spells all day long and the real hammers here are the shaggoths. The lists are both small model counts that rely on the monstrous infantry rules to inflict damage. I have screening units in both to help get them into combat intact and magic to bust a few holes in things as I close in. What do you all think? Which one would do better? They the same? I think ogres have the shooting advantage, where the trolls can regenerate....
Friday, July 16, 2010
Warhammer 8th is upon us
I've been kind of musing about Warhammer fantasy for a few years. I even had a full night goblin list a few years back I ended up dumping on E-bay....boy do I regret that. Well the new version of the rules looks fantastic (the collectors edition rulebook certainly helps), and I am now officially psyked to get some games in. I have about 90% of a vampire counts army on hand. Though the original concept from a year ago has changed, I do think I am going to try and make them a magical power house list.
Ill start with Mannfred....almighty Mannfred Von Carstein. Awesome in his own right 8th edition has given him one heck of a boost. Combine him with another vampire or two with masters of the dark arts and BAMM one awsome magic phase.....I might even throw in a pair of magic staffs from the Arcane items list....yes tasty...I'll even back that up with a pair of corpse carts with balefire....-2 on all those casting rolls for you!
The old Horde rule was just MADE for zombies. Especially with a vamp hiding in a unit of 60....
2 units of skellies and some ghouls to guard the flanks of that mess, some grave guard as a hammer, and even a varghulf for artillery hunting.
It all sounds great on paper, but you know what they say about the best laid plans.....
Ill start with Mannfred....almighty Mannfred Von Carstein. Awesome in his own right 8th edition has given him one heck of a boost. Combine him with another vampire or two with masters of the dark arts and BAMM one awsome magic phase.....I might even throw in a pair of magic staffs from the Arcane items list....yes tasty...I'll even back that up with a pair of corpse carts with balefire....-2 on all those casting rolls for you!
The old Horde rule was just MADE for zombies. Especially with a vamp hiding in a unit of 60....
2 units of skellies and some ghouls to guard the flanks of that mess, some grave guard as a hammer, and even a varghulf for artillery hunting.
It all sounds great on paper, but you know what they say about the best laid plans.....
Friday, July 9, 2010
Buckeye Battles RTT July 9
Well, I did it. I jumped back in to the competitive tournament scene with both feet, and swam surprisingly well despite having been almost 2 years since my last "major" tournament. I played with my mechanized Volscani 4th traitor Imperial Guard in the Buckeye Battles RTT today along with a couple of other guys from the Armoury. Richard and Tim. While I can't remember score specifics, the both did really well too.
Game 1 is always an unknown in these things because you start out with no indication of how your day is going to go. Contrary to my usual negative self, I decided that dammit, I was gonna have a good day, socres be damned. Brian, my first opponent played eldar from a flotilla instead of a craftworld. He called them the "Featherblade Strikeforce". I really liked his cool teal color with a warm bone trim. Nice army, super nice guy. While I don't remember specific units he had one wave serpent and one falcon, the rest was on foot. I won first turn and started peeling his infantry half a squad at a time. The deployment was a slightly modified spearhead with a 9 inch radius center circle. Table quarter deployment allowed me to place poor Brian's foot eldar mostly in the open. Since there were 5 objectives I had decided to hold 3 and blow him off the other 2. This worked out well until turn 4 when his stupid fast tanks flew right over to my objectives....grrrr. Long story short I managed to pull a minor victory, but killed enough of his stuff to make it a major victory. Max score of 50 first round.
Game 2 was against Eric from the Soldiery, another FLGS in north Columbus. Three objective mission with 12 inch long board edge deployment. He had Nurgle chaos marines. 3 10 man plague marine units on foot, lord with nurgle mark and daemon weapon, 6 obliterators and a unit of 10 terminators with reaper, combi flamer and combi melta. Lots of sickness...no pun intended. What should have been a much harder game for me turned easier thanks to Eric's astoundingly bad dice rolls. I think he killed one tank the whole game....in close combat....Game over after 5 turns, 2 objectives to none, major victory for me.
Game 3 saw me *GASP* in a 4 way tie for first place!!!!! WOW that has NEVER happened to me before. I drew Jason Garner as my last opponent...oh no, my unicorn....(long story). He plays Eldar with Eldrad and a 10 man council.....ICK. This was a kill point mission, with 16 inch long board edge deployment. I can give up 25 kill points the way this mission was written, so it was dicey to start. Since I had 2 psyker battle squads, a full 320 of my 1750 was completely useless before we even deployed. Eldrad has runes that force psychic tests to be 3 dice....'nough said. Then he got first turn and killed both Demolishers before I could use them.... it did go reasonably well from there, but I just could not recover from the first turn handicap. In the end it was 10 kill points to 4, a 10 point Major loss.
I loved the tournament and had a great time. Apparently that showed because I took home the best sportsman award. I think that was the best award there, and I am extremely proud of it. You all humbled me by awarding me with it, so a hearty thank you, I am glad you had as good a time against me as I had playing you!!
So what did I take away? Simple 2 things, play to enjoy it. It shows and if your goal is fun, then you win regardless of your final scores. 2. im dropping one psyker squad and the HQ I took this time for a smaller HQ and adding either an executioner or a second Manticore.....my prize for the day. Haven't decided yet. LOL
Thanks to the guys running the event, Chris, Parker, Daniel, Doug, and all the rest. It was well run, smooth and above all FUN!!! (oh and MegaDave you still owe me that game!!)
Game 1 is always an unknown in these things because you start out with no indication of how your day is going to go. Contrary to my usual negative self, I decided that dammit, I was gonna have a good day, socres be damned. Brian, my first opponent played eldar from a flotilla instead of a craftworld. He called them the "Featherblade Strikeforce". I really liked his cool teal color with a warm bone trim. Nice army, super nice guy. While I don't remember specific units he had one wave serpent and one falcon, the rest was on foot. I won first turn and started peeling his infantry half a squad at a time. The deployment was a slightly modified spearhead with a 9 inch radius center circle. Table quarter deployment allowed me to place poor Brian's foot eldar mostly in the open. Since there were 5 objectives I had decided to hold 3 and blow him off the other 2. This worked out well until turn 4 when his stupid fast tanks flew right over to my objectives....grrrr. Long story short I managed to pull a minor victory, but killed enough of his stuff to make it a major victory. Max score of 50 first round.
Game 2 was against Eric from the Soldiery, another FLGS in north Columbus. Three objective mission with 12 inch long board edge deployment. He had Nurgle chaos marines. 3 10 man plague marine units on foot, lord with nurgle mark and daemon weapon, 6 obliterators and a unit of 10 terminators with reaper, combi flamer and combi melta. Lots of sickness...no pun intended. What should have been a much harder game for me turned easier thanks to Eric's astoundingly bad dice rolls. I think he killed one tank the whole game....in close combat....Game over after 5 turns, 2 objectives to none, major victory for me.
Game 3 saw me *GASP* in a 4 way tie for first place!!!!! WOW that has NEVER happened to me before. I drew Jason Garner as my last opponent...oh no, my unicorn....(long story). He plays Eldar with Eldrad and a 10 man council.....ICK. This was a kill point mission, with 16 inch long board edge deployment. I can give up 25 kill points the way this mission was written, so it was dicey to start. Since I had 2 psyker battle squads, a full 320 of my 1750 was completely useless before we even deployed. Eldrad has runes that force psychic tests to be 3 dice....'nough said. Then he got first turn and killed both Demolishers before I could use them.... it did go reasonably well from there, but I just could not recover from the first turn handicap. In the end it was 10 kill points to 4, a 10 point Major loss.
I loved the tournament and had a great time. Apparently that showed because I took home the best sportsman award. I think that was the best award there, and I am extremely proud of it. You all humbled me by awarding me with it, so a hearty thank you, I am glad you had as good a time against me as I had playing you!!
So what did I take away? Simple 2 things, play to enjoy it. It shows and if your goal is fun, then you win regardless of your final scores. 2. im dropping one psyker squad and the HQ I took this time for a smaller HQ and adding either an executioner or a second Manticore.....my prize for the day. Haven't decided yet. LOL
Thanks to the guys running the event, Chris, Parker, Daniel, Doug, and all the rest. It was well run, smooth and above all FUN!!! (oh and MegaDave you still owe me that game!!)
Wednesday, July 7, 2010
It's been a while....
Well I had my break, and the beach fully recharged my batteries. I am fully ready to kick someone in the gibblies (or get kick if it comes to it) on Friday the 9th July at Buckeye battles 40k RTT. You can see the details here. My local gaming club is helping to run the event and you can see their site, along with the missions here.
I really am looking forward to this, as I get to throw down with the best that central- Ohio (and a large part of the mid-west) has to offer.
On a side note I got bumped out of the campaign by a last minute rally from Richard, so now they are down to the last game this week to determine the winner. Good luck guys! (curses!!)
Warhammer Fantasy Battles (WHFB) releases it's 8th edition rules on July 10, so I'll be making a trip to The Armoury to pick up a copy. I ordered the collector edition which is supposedly sold out. I hope Bruce was able to get me a copy as the sales rep told him (crosses fingers)
Now on to the important question....what army to do....Throgg troll army or skeleton horde vampires?
I really am looking forward to this, as I get to throw down with the best that central- Ohio (and a large part of the mid-west) has to offer.
On a side note I got bumped out of the campaign by a last minute rally from Richard, so now they are down to the last game this week to determine the winner. Good luck guys! (curses!!)
Warhammer Fantasy Battles (WHFB) releases it's 8th edition rules on July 10, so I'll be making a trip to The Armoury to pick up a copy. I ordered the collector edition which is supposedly sold out. I hope Bruce was able to get me a copy as the sales rep told him (crosses fingers)
Now on to the important question....what army to do....Throgg troll army or skeleton horde vampires?
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